Showing posts with label 5700 105 caliper. Show all posts
Showing posts with label 5700 105 caliper. Show all posts

Sunday, 28 July 2013

Building a New Bike

This year I have had a slight nagging urge whether to go for an "N+1". This is the perennial dilemma for an enthusiastic cyclist apparently - do I want another bike. Note its want not need. This want could be for a different type of bike or just for something "better".

In my case I have 3 bikes - a cheap (free) aluminium MTB in shopping guise (slicks, mudguards etc), my Giant Defy which is the Winter and commuting bike and my Focus Cayo which is my Summer and "best" bike. Three is realistically the most I can justify and I hove no desire to be a mountain biker - so its a town bike, Winter bike and Summer bike. So the N+1 would be a N-1+1 leaving me 3 bikes. The -1+1 part would be the Focus - the Giant is a good bike, has some upgrades to make it better than it was when I got it and seems to take all that I throw at it year in year out (over 10000 miles so far) without complaining.

The plan would therefore be to replace the Focus. However to replace the Focus like-for-like would be about £1500 or so, so I'd need to look at something around £2500 to be a worth while step up, and even then I'd need to be careful that the newer machine was actually "better enough" to justify to myself the spend. The potential new bike would be funded by the sale of the Focus and some of my 2013 Performance Bonus. Despite this I am still careful with money so while I was looking I was not actually looking that hard and was quite happy with the Focus.

Unfortunately I then saw a thread on the Bikeradar forums called The Scott CR1 SL Thread. A few pages in was a link to this:



Actually it was not quite this as the image shows the 2012 Scott CR1 Pro (not SL) but looking more carefully this was a £1300 frame/fork for £500. I dithered and thought about it but fortunately they sold out really quickly. This was good for 2 reasons - 1 - it showed that it must be a good deal and - 2- it saved me spending any money.

However unfortunately they came back in stock and they also added the Pro model for £450 as shown above. Reading the specification the difference was the type of Carbon fibre and the bottom bracket type (pressfit on the SL and threaded on the Pro) - everything else was pretty well the same. Frame/fork weight was quoted as 950/390g. I tried to find the equivalent weight of my Focus but couldn't. A Google search of Scott CR1 Pro bikes (assembled) shows they varied between £2000-3500 depending on other components fitted. In summary this was a serious bargain, and could actually mean that I could move nearly all the Focus components to this frame and build a seriously good bike for probably ~£600 (I knew that I'd need some other parts like a seat post, new cables etc.) but by doing this I could get close to a £2500 bike for £600. Many of the parts on my Focus are pretty reasonable - its got Shimano RS80 C24 wheels, a mostly Shimano 105 5700 drive train, 105 5700 brakes so its not too bad. If I got the Pro I could move my FSA chainset across (whereas with the SL I'd probably need a new chainset).

So after some further pondering I bit the bullet and ordered a Pro in 54cm. Great service from Westbrook Cycles (who I have not used before) - ordered on a Saturday - arrived 10am Tuesday with about 3 texts to keep me informed of progress.

On opening the box and lifting the frame out my first thought was - wow! It was really light. The box was probably 3 times the weight of the frame. In the box was frame (with derailier hanger, , bottle cage bolts, seat post clamp and some self adhesive patches to prevent cable rub on the frame), the fork and the Ritchey headset. No instructions included either for the frame or the headset. I didn't do anything more that evening other than wonder how I might assemble the headset.

Headset Assembly
In fact the headset was the bit that worried me the most. I have never actually cut a steerer and pressed in headset bearings before. I understood the process and theory but had never put it into practice, and to try for the first time on a £1300 frame and fork was not something I was keen on. I saw a number of potential pitfalls, the following 3 being the worst case:
  • getting steerer length wrong
  • cutting the steerer not square
  • pressing the bearings in wrongly and damaging the frame
Cutting the Steerer Length Wrong
For the steerer length challenge I could measure and check lots of times, so this was a lower risk. I could also make the first build with a longer steerer length so I could have a go at one length and have scope to have a second go to get to the right length. Risk - LOW


Cutting the Steerer not Square
For cutting the steerer not square I know from using a hacksaw that however hard I try I always seem to drift off and ideally I'd like to use a cutting guide that I don't have, like this:

Cyclus Fork Steerer Cutting Guide

Cyclus Fork Steerer Cutting Guide

At around £60 for this tool this was very expensive seeing as I might never use it again. Given some time and access to some machine tools (big drill or lathe and and saw) this is not too difficult to make. However without this: Risk - HIGH

Headset Bearing Pressing
For pressing the bearings in wrongly - the bearings I knew would only go in with a tool. This type of tool at around £35:


Cyclus Headset Press

Cyclus Headset Press



An alternative is something like this from eBay for about £4:


*HEADSET PRESS INSERTION TOOL AT LOW COST WITH HANDLE*

This tool I could make myself as I had some studding and washers.

I would also need some sort of Crown race fitting tool at around £25:


Cyclus Crown Race Fitting Tool

Cyclus Crown Race Fitting Tool

If I got fitting the bearings wrong the risk of damage to the frame was high, so: Risk - HIGH

Therefore I was looking at about £60-80 worth of tools for a possible 1 off job and I was nervous of all 3 major operations.


Therefore for the first time I rang a couple of Local shops to see what it would cost. If it was over £50 then I'd look to do it myself, if less I would have it done.

Firstly I tried Red Kite - price was very reasonable at £12 but they couldn't have a look until September - so 6-7 weeks away - I was not in a great hurry but I wanted it sooner than that! They aimed to have 2.5 mechanics and only had 1 apparently hence the problem

Secondly I tried Cult Racing - a little further away but their web page did identify a fully warranted job. I rang them and was asked to ring back as the mechanic was out on the club ride. Ringing back later the response was "it's £12 and bring it round after 4 when we're less busy and we'll do it". So that's what I did.

So the current state is I have my Scott with the head set fitted and steerer cut (with a temporary steerer fitted) and its now awaiting me to start swapping bits over from my Focus.

Monday, 21 January 2013

Shimano 105 Shifters Revisted

Caution - Work in Progress!! 

Further update here: Building new bike part 3 observations

A while ago I wrote a short piece about the experiences I had when I fitted Shimano 105 5700 series shifters to my bike to replace the 5600 series originally fitted.

The reason for the change/upgrade was that I really wanted to upgrade my other bike (Giant Defy 4) to 10 speed and whist I had the cassette, chain and dérailleurs for the bike I did not have any spare shifters. As these are by far the most expensive part of the drive train it took a long time to decide on the correct strategy to get 10 speed on both bikes for the least amount of money but best compromise seemed to be to upgrade the shifters on the Focus and move the original shifters to the Giant.

The Focus came with the 5600 series parts, but at the time I was looking into this the newer 5700 series had been around for about a year. Part of the decision was also that it appeared increasingly difficult to get the 5600 parts, although they were slightly cheaper. From what I could make out the most prominent differences between 5600 & 5700 parts were that the 5700 had the shifter cables running under the bar tape alongside the brake cables whilst the older 5600 has the shifter cables coming out of the side of the shifters.

Here is a picture of each:

5600

5700


More subtle differences are apparently a more ergonomic shifter design and different pull ratios for the brakes and front dérailleur, although seemingly not the rear dérailleur. Because of this it is seemingly necessary to run a full 5700 system with the new shifters.

The pull ratio change was difficult one to find out more about. Given the physical dimensions of the shifters and the basic geometry of the brake caliper it was hard to see how different it could be. A search of the internet was not particularly helpful either. All of them basically say what I have summarised above.

After much heart searching (and internet price comparisons) I bit the bullet and bought a pair of the 5700 shifters for the Focus. I did also decide to get a 5700 front mech as these are relatively cheap.

I waited until the bad weather around Christmas 2011 (when I had some spare holiday to use) and fitted the parts to the bikes. Given that it was winter I did not ride the Focus for several months but the Giant carried on being ridden. I didn't notice any change to the Giant compared to the Focus (after all it has the same parts fitted), although up-shifting on the rear is not always as crisp as I remembered - it will either not quite shift up a gear and need a slight extra nudge, or will shift up 2 gears when only one is requested. I think this is due to a little wear on the right shifter but also because the medium cage (GS) rear mech is not as stiff as the short cage. Any way I live with it as I think it's one of those jobs that could absorb hours without making it any better.

However on the Focus all was not quite as well. Firstly the upgrade was completed before Christmas so it was not ridden. Testing the bike in the work stand suggested that the front mech was quite stiff to shift up to the big ring and sprung back very "positively" when dropping onto the small ring. Its really hard to get a good feel in the workstand as your hands are not in the normal riding position. I had a fiddle but left it until I planned to ride it again when I would have a better view.

Because of the weather I did not ride the bike until early March and this really highlighted 2 things - the back brake was pretty well in-effective and the lever load for the front mech was very high.

The back brake issue is discussed here: Shimano 105 5700 mechanicals (as is the first draft of this review) and seemed to be related to a rusty brake cable. My view of the front brake performance comparison between the original (6600?) Ultegra and the new 5700 105 calipers is that if there is a difference its almost undetectable, and probably more affected by rim/brake pad combination than the pull ratio.

I have also looked more at the front mech load - it "feels" at least twice as hard to shift up a gear than the 5600 combination. With the cable disconnected and moving the mech by hand it does not feel excessively stiff, but via the shifter is harder than the older model. The cable routing around the bottom bracket is identical to the initial install, and learning the lesson from the rusty brake cable I have checked the cable - both for rust, cleanliness, smoothness of outer cable, cable radii etc and can see nothing wrong. I am sort of resigned to it. Most of the time where I live I can ride on the big ring most of the time so its not that I am making dozens of changes a ride.

Despite the disappointingly high front shifting load the rear shifting is excellent - much better than the 5600 (and I am still using a 5600 105 short cage rear mech) - up and down it never misses a shift, very slick and positive.

When I do another major service I will probably change both inner and outer front cables regardless and try that to see if it makes any difference. I am not sure if the cable run from under the bottom bracket affects it - I'll post a photo another time, but it's the same as before.

So - does the pull ratio change make a difference?
  • Front brakes - no
  • Rear brakes - no
  • Rear mech - no
  • Front mech - I can't tell but the shifting load is high
Hope this helps